Discuss.

I'm going to say "no" with a disclaimer. If someone applies that knows someone in VS or is highly recommended by someone in VS, then I say we accept the app and see if they fit in. Otherwise, I'd like to get to know everyone a little better before full-on recruitment again. That's my 2 cents.

Can we also insist that all new recruits must join our SP cult?

I agree with Sapphyre. Applicants should have a sponsor within VS. We're such a tight-knit clan that opening to random people can hurt us, but having extended friends is a good thing.

For what it's worth, I agree with Saph and Stranger. I think we have plenty of people at the moment and don't have all the drama that comes with a large guild.

Not that I'm around so much, but I agree with the sentiment. There are so many people in the guild I don't know. We still have the "family feel" when I log on though, and I don't want to lose that (admittedly it's a bit of a twisted and freaky family, but I wouldn't have it any other way).

Sponsorship FTW

If we'd had sponsorship in the past, more than half of us wouldn't be here.

Good point Gleja. I know I wouldn't be here if you needed a sponsor. My only concern is Nestor-type people slipping through the cracks now that we're getting big and causing problems. We can always just /gkick after the aggravation & drama (not like it happens that much) but why deal with the stress if we don't have to. I'm not an officer and wouldn't be doing the kicking so it's no sweat off my back, but the people getting das boot usually get crazy and pisses off whoever has to break the news.

Just to clarify my point... I wasn't suggesting that we always ask for sponsorship. I was simply saying maybe we could stop recruting for a month or two and THEN open recruitment up to the general public again.

BUT, I also think that even when we are not recruiting, we should allow people to apply if they already know someone in VS.

While it's true that many people might not have been here if they'd needed a sponsor before, how many of you really feel you couldn't have been here if you'd needed a sponsor? In other words, as I see it, if someone's really interested in joining the guild, it isn't difficult to speak with a VS member and say 'Hey, want to group up for a while? I'd like to learn more about your guild.' Or to post on our forums and say, 'Hey, I'm interested in joining but I don't have a sponsor. Would someone find me in-game and talk to me?'. It shows real interest and a willingness to meet people.

The other side to this is that current guild members need to be willing to hang out with total strangers when they ask.

Sponsorship sounds elitist and snooty... just my opinion.

Keeping in mind the average WoW player...I am elitist and snooty.

Had their been a sponsorship requirement, I wouldn't have made it into VS. Now, that may really not be a bad thing, but it would also mean:

Jamisia
Arolaide
Linnaris
Ingomar
Skypop
Karigan

Wouldn't have made the initial round. Furthermore:

Viraj
Lyranne
Calliana
Papaw
Flaith
Kroven
Eulalia wouldn't have made it either.

And if I'm not mistaken, Stranger wouldn't have made it in either. I'm with Sherica on this one. I'm all for closing recruiting at certain points to give the existing guild base a chase to get to know new recruits, but sponsorship?

Our old guild on Dalaran was a "friends and family" guild. We had a "sponsorship" type of process in place. We also ended up with some extremely fucktarded individuals.

Our old guild on Dalaran was a "friends and family" guild. We had a "sponsorship" type of process in place. We also ended up with some extremely fucktarded individuals.



LOOKS AROUND ::)


On that note, we sent Val ahead to test the waters thinking if you would take such an asshat as him then we had it made :)


Im for either having a open recruit or closed. While closed friends or family could still apply.

I agree with Val here. I do not think sponsorship is a good idea at all. With open recruiting we have gotten some really fantastic people - unfortunately it's the relatively few asshats like Nestor that stand out in our minds, but we're talking 1 out of every 15+ unsponsored apps have ended badly. That is a ratio that I can live with. As long as we have officers willing to do what is needed should someone "inappropriate" join the guild, I think we're fine. The whole Nestor thing lasted a whopping 1 day before Jakiera took care of business.

At the same time, I think the only need we have is to close recruiting periodically to get to know our newcomers better. It's been about 2 months now. I think it's safe to invite a few more into the fold. Then, we should probably close general recruiting but consider applications through the rest of the holidays, as there are going to be a LOT more players as a result of the holidays and the expansion pack.

Besides, "We Know" requires sponsorship - do we really want to have that much in common with them? :D

I think there's a difference between, 'open recruiting' and 'open enrollment.'

With open recruiting, there are people talking on GuildRecruitment; there's a post on the WoW forums in Eitrigg and Guild Advertisements; we are actively looking for people. I don't think we have to actively look for people, and I think we're good there keeping that on the downlow.

With open enrollment, anyone who plays around with us somewhere or who happens to spy the webpage and like what they read can apply. I think that this is the way to go, always, and not just because it maintains our friendly and open atmosphere. What harm is there in keeping the status quo or letting people who think they'd like us (or vice versa) apply whenever they'd like?

I <3 Aro's opinions.

I <3 Fox's endorsements of Aro's opinions.

Fox, is that a blanket statement? i.e. You <3 ALL of Aro's opinions? Aro -- I think he's given you carte blanche to speak on his behalf from now on so you should get two votes on everything! ;)

Sponsorship = bad. It's just as easy to put up a fake image in front of your sponsor as it is to fill out an application. This method really solves nothing outside of making it look like sponsors have bad judgement when an applicant slips through the cracks.
Besides, this is a game and sponsoring someone is way too much like "work" for my tastes.

Keeping Open Recruitment closed = Definitely. We really have no need anymore to be actively searching for more players. We have a nice, solid base here that can consistently handle anything Blizzard throws at us, no need to flood the ranks.

Open Enrollment = Good. I see no problem with this method so long as we continue to close it every so often to get to know everyone like we have been doing.

And if I'm not mistaken, Stranger wouldn't have made it in either.


Either you've got me confused with someone else, or you and I mean vastly different things by 'sponsorship.'

What I mean by 'sponsorship' is 'You have to know someone in the guild who'll say 'Hey, I've actually spoken to this person and he seems cool.'' I don't mean 'You have to have someone who'll hold your hand and be your buddy and bake you cookies.' What I'm talking about is asking people to make an effort to actually speak to one person in the guild before randomly applying to it...and I totally fail to see how this is asking too much. But then, I can't for the life of me imagine why on earth anyone would apply to a guild if they haven't ever spoken to anyone in it...and aren't willing to speak to anyone in it...before writing up an app. I may be weird that way.

I just figure that anyone who applies should be able to name at least one guild member who'd be able to speak for him and say 'Yes, I've talked to Jim Bo Billy Bob the Druid, and he's not a total spaz.' And personally, I'd be awfully hesitant about anyone who couldn't.

And that's what I'm talking about when I speak of sponsorship.

What are you talking about?

I don't feel comfortable with your demonic avatar stranger, it is encroaching on my decrees.

I do, however, agree with a bunch of the stuff said. We have no reason to actively recruit, but I feel comfortable accepting the others who have found us through friends, rare random pugs, whatever.

It all sounds good to me, the open enrollment. However I think we need to be more vigilent on the probation period.

buncha weirdos out there.

What I mean by 'sponsorship' is 'You have to know someone in the guild who'll say 'Hey, I've actually spoken to this person and he seems cool.'' I don't mean 'You have to have someone who'll hold your hand and be your buddy and bake you cookies.' What I'm talking about is asking people to make an effort to actually speak to one person in the guild before randomly applying to it...and I totally fail to see how this is asking too much. But then, I can't for the life of me imagine why on earth anyone would apply to a guild if they haven't ever spoken to anyone in it...and aren't willing to speak to anyone in it...before writing up an app. I may be weird that way.


Exactly.

Now I say beers all around - I'm buyin'.

I don't feel comfortable with your demonic avatar stranger, it is encroaching on my decrees.

Muahahahahahaha.

C'mere, little naked man, I have a spike for ya.

And if I'm not mistaken, Stranger wouldn't have made it in either.


What are you talking about?



What HE is talking about is the fact that if there WERE sponsorship required, myself, Arolaide, Valneron, etc. would NOT BE IN THE GUILD in the first place. We knew no one at all when we first joined (Val being the first one to have done so) back in March/April. And if Arolaide weren't here, neither would you. It's a perfectly logical argument.

Anyway, I totally agree with Aro's sentiments. I do not like the idea of sponsorship. I think our current method is just fine - we do NOT actively try to recruit, but if we get any apps in, whether they are already friends of guild members or someone completely new, we evaluate them , possibly add them as an initiate for a probationary period, and go from there.

Also note from your other comments - Pretty much everyone who joins, regardless of their app, HAS been talked to in one form or another before receiving a guild invite. That's what the ENL channel is for, and also in the vast majority of cases someone has at least talked to them beforehand. The only time this has failed utterly in months was Nestor, and as noted, that was resolved very quickly.